Debate topic of the day

[jumper69]

I have a problem with immigrants who come here who refuse to learn the language and demand that accomodations are made for them. Like ballots.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Or answering systems that ask you to press 1 for English, 2 for Spanish, 3 for whatever other language du jour.

Or Spanish television stations that outnumber English speaking ones (Chicago).

Shall I go on.... [img]graemlins/whatever.gif[/img]

[Dulcinea]

Originally posted by gae:

I have a problem with immigrants who come here who refuse to learn the language and demand that accomodations are made for them. Like ballots.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, I have somewhat of a problem with that too, mostly fear of a slippery slope/entitlement mentality kind of thing. On the one hand, I wouldn't want to disenfranchise a citizen, on the other hand where do you draw the line? And for this reason, I really dislike that, as you say, some immigrants "demand" accomodations be made.

Jumper's thing about menus and having to choose Spanish/English is an irksome thing for me, what an annoyance that I have to deal with another screen before I can do my business! But then again, this is NOT generally my tax dollars at work, but the decision of men of business that this is something they choose to do to remain competitive for the largest group of $$.

And no, I don't think you should be REQUIRED to learn Spanish if you want to move to Mexico. Not to do so would be really, really dumb though, and I don't think you are that.

And.....I want to second Pi?a's point about providing the means to succeed. If it's my tax dollars at work, I'd far rather the money be spent on ESL night classes and tutors in immigrant communities than in multilingual accomodations that enable them to NOT learn English.

[Ickey]

I feel the need to speak on this.

Where I now work is a small town of about 2500. 48% of the population is now hispanic, as the pork company that operates around here bussed them in for workers.

These people DON'T CARE about learning english. They don't have to. PSF employs them, hires spanish-speaking mid-level management, sends company HR people with them to places such as the DMV, court, city hall, etc. etc. etc.

Most of the population are decent enough people, and they do work hard. But it is damned near impossible to effectively do my job when the language barrier is so tall. So what is everyone's answer? Learn spanish.

BULLSHIT!

This is an English speaking country. They knew that when they immigrated. I'm tired of being told I need to respect their culture, language, etc.etc.. They need to respect mine! But that makes me un-american because this nation is founded on immigration and tolerance of the multicultural make-up of our population.

If that's the case, so be it. I'll be un-american while I privately wish for a nation that it is united, and can speak to each other at the same time.

BTW, have I shared my views on Kwanza? [img]graemlins/whatever.gif[/img]

[Sluggo]

Amen to that, Ickey! [img]mad.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/grrr.gif[/img]

[gae]

Yes, thanks for that Ickey. You made my point.

Bob and I are hatching a plan to move to Central America. We're 5 to 10 years out, and just beginning to do the research necessary for what we want. From what I've learned over the past 12 months, English is taught as a second language, and most folks are conversant. So, I'd be able to conduct all the business dealings with folks in my language.

What a plus for us! Maybe it's just me, but I think it would be rude to not arrive with Spanish as a language. Granted, I won't be completely fluent, and given the choice of reviewing legal documents in English or Spanish, I'll take English. And understand that they are accomodating me, for which I am grateful.

But, if we wanted a place that didn't have English as a second language, I'd be damned sure I found a bilingual attorney, banker and investment broker.

One of Erin's MBA classmates is from Russia. Inga's English is often hilarious, but dammit, she tries.

When we were in England a couple of years ago I went to the post office to mail postcards and a letter. (That makes sense to all of you, right?) I asked the clerk to affix the proper postage to mail the cards to the US. She was perplexed, and asked me just what I wanted to do. I finally remembered all the Brit novels I've read and asked her to please "post" them.

If people want to live here, speak our language. If I want to live elsewhere, I'll speak yours.

Oh, and Ick, did you mean Kwanza? That silly made-up holiday? I'd love to hear it.

[gae]

I repectfully diagree, AL.

I understand your point about the elders, but I think they should at least try to learn.

I don't care how broken the language is, if one doesn't make an attempt it's a slap in the face to the host country.

My Spanish is horrible. The little bit I can speak is with a French or American accent. Everyone I interacted with in Mexico and Spain appreciated the effort and got a few chuckles out of my mangulations. [img]smile.gif[/img]

That being said, does anyone know of a local place to learn conversational Spanish?

[cincygreg]

Typos dont count [img]wink.gif[/img]

Anywho, I would tend to think that a person would want to at least make an effort to try and understand the language that is prominent in the country or area where they live.


[img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]cool.gif[/img] [img]smile.gif[/img]

[Boo Boo]

I pretty much agree with Gae and Icky. Remember the Middle Eastern woman who sued because the Florida BMV would not take her driver's license picture with her veil on? She claimed it was her culture not to remove her veil....well guess what lady, it is not your culture to be able to drive or sue your government.

My Father in law came to the US in the 50's. He will tell you proudly that he is an AMERICAN GERMAN, not German American. He learned English while fighting for the US in the Korean War. He lives the American dream, he adapted to the American way of life, but still has his culture and heritage. The one thing he wishes he could change is teach Americans to correct way to play soccer. [img]graemlins/soccer.gif[/img]